Mother tongues: Chinese, Indonesian Posts: 1 Joined: July 15, 2007 Location: Indonesia
RE: Direct job offers: Be careful!
Dear all,
This seems like a very old topic but still give me a lot of insight about translation business. After reading thoroughly, I found that working with anyone is risky, especially when you can't directly communicate with them face to face and only rely on email as a mean of communication. Luckily, all of my clients up until now come from the same city and I can meet directly with them ^^
In this last two weeks, I receive emails from 2 different agencies asking for my particular CV (without giving any contact number of my past clients, just like the Tips in "Dealing with Agencies") as well as my help in translating some documents.
Before I decide who to work with, I have followed Nikita's way in Post #114127 (Page 1, Translators Rating for people without Master Membership) and find 5 star rating by one person. I also search the Agency Name and find 5 posts in the Hall of Fame and Shame.
The question is : I could not determine if a 5 star rating by one person is good enough or not. Talking from the negative side, theoritically I could create another account and give myself a 5-rated star. And I could not see the Agencies' name listed on the "Fame Side" or the "Shame Side", only there are posts in that Forum. Could anyone give me a suggestion about this matter?
Your help will be much appreciated. Thank you in advance ^^
Originally written by Ina Brachmann on November 27, 2008 6:53 AM Does anybody have some advice how to proceed. I am not willing to do anything for this guy anymore, but I am losing a lot of money as well.
The most simple way, I`d say, is to submit the translated text minus spaces. Easy done and rather undecipherable, yet your client can see the wok has been done - only unusable until paid for. When you are paid, you send your client the copy with spaces. As simple as that.
[Edited by Dodo Kaipdodo on November 27, 2008 12:02 PM]
Originally written by Ina Brachmann on November 27, 2008 12:08 PM I submitted already the translated text.
Then you can report the nasty client to the HFS.
If it were that easy, why there is this long thread about this topic.
Few use this method precisely because it seems - and is - too easy. No supersmart software to buy, no supersmart help to engage... Yet the simple ways are most effective. Power to your elbow, Ina!
Ina,
what is the problem with your client (representing someone else) requesting you to modify the translation to their needs. As you do not have a contract specifying payment terms and your quality guarantee (I mean free corrections within a reasonable period of time or the like) I suggest - however, I confess, I have never been in such a situation - that you negotiate this with your client now, before any further work is done on the text.
If I understand correctly, you received the job, delivered on time, and it was accepted by your client, who later returned to you that his client, on the other hand, is not happy with it.
If the client is bona fide, he will accept that you delivered, so he has the obligation to pay. If he needs further corrections to the text, it can be done after the payment has arrived to your account. It may take days or even more than a week between banks, but if you can use online services as paypal, moneybookers and the like, it can be done instantly. Tell them that you gave a good translation, it is their turn now.
If I were in your place (which is not the case, of course), I would tell my client to pay the agreed price before anything else happens (or at least half of it ). Then I would require the client to specify the issues/problems whatever the client feels are not meeting their needs - a clarification. Without that you can't move on with the translation. If they don't pay first, then then there is no translation to correct.
But all this depends on your relationship with the client, its client if you know it, etc.
As to this thread: I posted to this (or to a very similar topic) in March or April 2007 (I can't find those posts now) a problem after the fact, that is, my 'client' disappeared with my translation without paying for it, and I came here for suggestions, help. What I got was to the effect that I should have been more prudent (true) and why didn't I first read their very useful recommendations at this site for working with unknown clients (true). Most of the comments on the thread were a waste of time, pounding the same story, irrespective of the actual situation. I hope this time it will be more helpful for you!
Simon
Mother tongue: Bulgarian Posts: 3 Joined: April 23, 2007 Location: Bulgaria
RE: Direct job offers from end clients
Originally written by Dodo Kaipdodo on November 27, 2008 11:59 AM
Originally written by Ina Brachmann on November 27, 2008 6:53 AM Does anybody have some advice how to proceed. I am not willing to do anything for this guy anymore, but I am losing a lot of money as well.
The most simple way, I`d say, is to submit the translated text minus spaces. Easy done and rather undecipherable, yet your client can see the wok has been done - only unusable until paid for. When you are paid, you send your client the copy with spaces. As simple as that.
Mother tongue: Finnish Joined: June 11, 2008 Location: Finland
RE: Translatorsunited!
Originally written by Ina Brachmann on December 1, 2008 2:35 PM I decided to take action and just bought a domain www.translatorsunited.com to create a forum for all translators, interpreters freelance workers or everybody who might feel related to this topic in any possible way.
My plan is to get volunteers involved and provide legal documents to download for a small fee. There is no membership or any commercial background behind this. Please spread the news.
The current status of the site does look rather commercial. "Lock picking"? "Spy equipment"?
Perhaps it would be a good idea to whip together a placeholder index page of your own, before too many users and bots judge the site by its current content.
Mother tongue: English Joined: April 30, 2007 Location: Germany
RE: Direct job offers from end clients
Originally written by Ina Brachmann on November 28, 2008 7:42 AM I did something similar and did clarify that my translation is not to be used without payment resp, my permission (has not being answered by the client yet). I have an assignment with the client saying that, when and how I have to deliver, which I have done so far. Currently I am working on a general/legal/contract agreement to be signed for before any translation or alteration for the future.
This all sounds to me like a lot of fuss about nothing at all. I have been freelance translating and giving out translation work since 1979 and never had any problem of the type you describe with any customer or translator in that entire time. It seems to me that you might have forgotten Translator's Rule #2: "Choose your customers carefully!"
I certainly am not going to insist on a written contract for a mere translation job and I decline to sign one if an agency asks me to. When I give out translation work, I do not ask the translator to sign a contract nor would I give work to a translator who insisted on having a written contract. Amateur contracts are far worse than no contract at all. Would you expect the average translator or agency owner to have had training in contract law or to have his/her own contract lawyer on the payroll?
I have translated for many direct customers who maintain their own legal departments and not one of them has ever suggested having a written contract, even for very big jobs - a purchase order has always been sufficient. If you insist that one of those customers signs a contract then you are going to involve their legal department and that would mean that you would have to show up for contract negotiations with your own contract lawyer. No, I believe that you are on the wrong track, Ina! Take more care vetting your potential customers and you won't get into the position that you find yourself in now.
If you insist on having a written contract then you are presumably prepared to enforce it in the courts. Do you have the time and resources to do that? If you are not prepared to enforce it then it is a hollow sham. I have always maintained that most translators work with one foot in the courtroom; what you are proposing would get them there with both feet!
Derek
[Edited by Derek Thornton on December 1, 2008 11:37 AM]
Mother tongue: Polish Joined: February 18, 2003 Location: Poland
RE: Direct job offers from end clients
Originally written by Derek Thornton on December 1, 2008 5:11 PM
I have been freelance translating and giving out translation work since 1979 and never had any problem ....
I certainly am not going to insist on a written contract for a mere translation job and I decline to sign one if an agency asks me to. When I give out translation work, I do not ask the translator to sign a contract nor would I give work to a translator who insisted on having a written contract.
The same here, but I suspect, Derek, that this may be limited to the world of dinosaurs which is on the verge of extinction...
Odmítnutí odpovědnosti za fóra: Názory vyjádřené na fórech jsou názory autorů a nemusí se vždy shodovat s názory vlastníka webových stránek a/nebo moderátorů. Považuje-li čtenář zveřejněný příspěvek za urážlivý, měl by uplatnit stížnost u moderátora daného fóra. Stížnost by měla být projednána do 24 hodin, ale respektujte prosím skutečnost, že moderátor může žít v odlišném časovém pásmu. Použití fóra vyjadřuje váš souhlas s Pravidly pro zveřejňování příspěvků na fórech.
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). Then I would require the client to specify the issues/problems whatever the client feels are not meeting their needs - a clarification. Without that you can't move on with the translation. If they don't pay first, then then there is no translation to correct.
But all this depends on your relationship with the client, its client if you know it, etc.
As to this thread: I posted to this (or to a very similar topic) in March or April 2007 (I can't find those posts now) a problem after the fact, that is, my 'client' disappeared with my translation without paying for it, and I came here for suggestions, help. What I got was to the effect that I should have been more prudent (true) and why didn't I first read their very useful recommendations at this site for working with unknown clients (true). Most of the comments on the thread were a waste of time, pounding the same story, irrespective of the actual situation. I hope this time it will be more helpful for you!
Simon
Great
