Posted: August 19, 2008 5:26 PM | Post #153570—in reply to #152193 |
Jeff Allen
Expert       Mother tongue: EnglishPosts: 1682 Joined: December 23, 2004 Location: France | RE: pronunciation poem: English is Tough Stuff Well, the plural form of mouse depends on context. I naturally say mice. When I was a trainer at Caterpillar, I chose to follow the usage of "mouses" of the key person I was training in the pilot phase for the regular cited (and expensive, and risky) project on controlled language writing and machine translation. I did check all kinds of user manuals and online (mid 90s), yet the plural form was nowhere to be found since the computer accessory was always cited in the singular form. I didn't feel that it was worth risking the acceptance of such an important project on a small issue of how to pronounce the plural form of the computer accessory, so I regularly said "mouses" in that environment. And I say "mice" to my kids today. The word "fish" is a bit more ambiguous. There is a sign in the aquarium/museum in Chicago that refers to "fishes". I seem to use both "fish" and "fishes" interchangeably for the plural. Jeff
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Posted: August 19, 2008 5:44 PM | Post #153572—in reply to #153570 |
David Kallans
Expert       Mother tongue: EnglishPosts: 1752 Joined: April 13, 2007 Location: United States | RE: pronunciation poem: English is Tough Stuff Originally written by Jeff Allen
There is a sign in the aquarium/museum in Chicago that refers to "fishes". I seem to use both "fish" and "fishes" interchangeably for the plural.
| There is a distinction between the plural forms of "fish" and "fishes." The two sentences below have different meanings:
1. There are three fish in this tank. 2. There are three fishes in this tank. Sentence No. 1 means that the number of swimming-things in the tank is three, and they may or may not be of the same species. Sentence No. 2 means that there are three separate species of fish in the tank.
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Posted: August 19, 2008 5:52 PM | Post #153573—in reply to #153570 |
Dodo Kaipdodo TC Master
Expert    Mother tongue: LithuanianPosts: 1549 Joined: August 8, 2007 Location: Lithuania | RE: pronunciation poem: English is Tough Stuff
Originally written by Jeff Allen on August 19, 2008 5:26 PM The word "fish" is a bit more ambiguous. There is a sign in the aquarium/museum in Chicago that refers to "fishes". I seem to use both "fish" and "fishes" interchangeably for the plural.
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Er... I say "fish" when I eat them, but "fishes" when I look at them and admire them...
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Posted: August 19, 2008 7:03 PM | Post #153578—in reply to #153572 |
Nanna Mercer
Expert     Mother tongues: English, DanishPosts: 9031 Joined: February 12, 2005 Location: Denmark | RE: pronunciation poem: English is Tough Stuff Originally written by David Kallans on August 19, 2008 11:44 PM
Originally written by Jeff Allen There is a sign in the aquarium/museum in Chicago that refers to "fishes". I seem to use both "fish" and "fishes" interchangeably for the plural.
| 1. There are three fish in this tank. 2. There are three fishes in this tank. Sentence No. 1 means that the number of swimming-things in the tank is three, and they may or may not be of the same species. Sentence No. 2 means that there are three separate species of fish in the tank. | Fascinating! I actually assumed (which goes to show you) that only fish and not fishes were plural. There are many fishes (not fish) in the sea? Nanna
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Posted: August 21, 2008 6:54 AM | Post #153695—in reply to #153578 |
Jonathan Downie
Elite Veteran      Mother tongue: EnglishPosts: 845 Joined: March 9, 2008 Location: United Kingdom | RE: pronunciation poem: English is Tough Stuff
Originally written by Nanna Mercer on August 19, 2008 7:03 PM
Originally written by David Kallans on August 19, 2008 11:44 PM
Originally written by Jeff Allen There is a sign in the aquarium/museum in Chicago that refers to "fishes". I seem to use both "fish" and "fishes" interchangeably for the plural.
| 1. There are three fish in this tank. 2. There are three fishes in this tank. Sentence No. 1 means that the number of swimming-things in the tank is three, and they may or may not be of the same species. Sentence No. 2 means that there are three separate species of fish in the tank. | Fascinating! I actually assumed (which goes to show you) that only fish and not fishes were plural. There are many fishes (not fish) in the sea? Nanna |
Nope, we say, there are plenty more fish in the sea, when someone has just been dumped by their girl/boyfriend. However, we would say "mackeral, herring and cod are all types of fish" or "mackerel, herring and cod are all fishes." English is weird.
What about "sheep"? Has anyone else heard "sheepsies" used as a diminuitive?
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Posted: August 21, 2008 7:16 AM | Post #153698—in reply to #153695 |
David Kallans
Expert       Mother tongue: EnglishPosts: 1752 Joined: April 13, 2007 Location: United States | RE: pronunciation poem: English is Tough Stuff Originally written by Jonathan Downie
What about "sheep"? Has anyone else heard "sheepsies" used as a diminuitive?
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I've heard the diminutive "lambie," but I think I've only heard it in a children's TV show where it may have been used to fit the ryhme and meter pattern (poetic license).
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Posted: August 21, 2008 4:05 PM | Post #153756—in reply to #55431 |
Marisa Paván
Veteran     Mother tongue: SpanishPosts: 260 Joined: April 6, 2003 Location: Argentina | RE: pronunciation poem: English is Tough Stuff Interesting examples of plural forms! I came across the word "monies" (as the plural form of "money") in a contract and I found it hard to identify the word at first. Then I looked it up in the dictionary and this is what I got: drawing accountequity method<script type=text/JavaScript>if (document.cookie.indexOf('come_from_search=') >= 0){var dt = new Date();dt.setTime((new Date()).getTime() - 24*60*60*1000);document.cookie = 'come_from_search=nope;expires=' + dt.toGMTString() + ';path=/';document.write('Find what you were looking for? ');}Marisa
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Posted: August 21, 2008 4:11 PM | Post #153758—in reply to #153756 |
Jacek K. TC Master
Mother tongue: Polish Joined: February 18, 2003 Location: Poland | RE: pronunciation poem: English is Tough Stuff
Hi Marisa,
I hope that these links can help:
http://www.englishforums.com/English/MoneyMoniesFoodFoods/ccvgj/post.htm
http://forum.wordreference.com/showthread.php?t=286505
http://www.english-test.net/forum/ftopic6777.html
Jacek
[Edited by Jacek K. on August 21, 2008 4:15 PM]
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Posted: August 21, 2008 4:33 PM | Post #153763—in reply to #55431 |
Marisa Paván
Veteran     Mother tongue: SpanishPosts: 260 Joined: April 6, 2003 Location: Argentina | RE: pronunciation poem: English is Tough Stuff Hi Jacek! Thanks a lot!!! Very useful information! Marisa 
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Posted: August 21, 2008 11:21 PM | Post #153784—in reply to #153763 |
David Kallans
Expert       Mother tongue: EnglishPosts: 1752 Joined: April 13, 2007 Location: United States | RE: pronunciation poem: English is Tough Stuff "Monies" is a word that I believe I have only ever seen in very formal legal documents, where it is roughly synonymous with "funds."
I expect the vast majority of English-speakers are not even aware that there is such a word.
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