Создано: January 27, 2009 6:47 AM | Сообщение 168145 — ответ на №168031 |
Jacek K. Мастер TC
 Родной язык: Polish На форумах с: February 18, 2003 Местонахождение: Poland | RE: Understanding the Financial Crisis Originally written by John Bunch on January 26, 2009 4:29 PM
- Financial crises are nothing new, they have been around as long as there have been financial markets - |
Market crashes are inevitable, but financial innovation and globalization have massively increased our vulnerability to them. http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200812u/market-crashes
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The wipeout in 401(k)’s has made it clear that there needs to be a better way to ensure that a lifetime of savings can’t be undone by forces beyond one’s control. (http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/26/opinion/26mon1.html?em)
[Отредактировано Jacek K., January 27, 2009 8:36 AM]
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Создано: January 27, 2009 4:07 PM | Сообщение 168274 — ответ на №168145 |
John Bunch
 Expert      Родной язык: EnglishСообщений: 1807 На форумах с: February 1, 2008 Местонахождение: United States | RE: Understanding the Financial Crisis Well, there are already better ways. You can just keep your money in cash, invest in gold, etc. People already have methods other than the 401k, so we don't need new legislation on that.
What we do need is transparency and rules on leverage (which, Jacek, you have posted about, and I agree with that).
The problem is, if people choose a super safe investement (T-bills or gold), and they see their neighbor's 401k rising by 10 % every year, do you think that they will stay with the bonds and gold and cash, or will they jump ship and "get on the train" ?
There is no reward without risk.
[Отредактировано John Bunch, January 27, 2009 4:08 PM]
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Создано: January 27, 2009 4:26 PM | Сообщение 168275 — ответ на №168145 |
Marie Glück Мастер TC
 Elite Veteran  Родные языки: German, FrenchСообщений: 1014 На форумах с: March 8, 2005 Местонахождение: Austria | RE: Understanding the Financial Crisis Hi Jacek,
My sister works in New York and will be retired in 2009 after working 90 years for one company with 401k.
Guess what? She is laid off 3 weeks ago (Maddoff) and will get no retirement. I am shocked to see how
downgraded the system has been. The rich, educated CEO practically stole money from the poor and continue
exploiting even amidst this big scandal by ordering jets, expensive office decors, etc...
Obama is their last chance to turn aroun and redeem themselves, Harmageddon will be next.
Can´t they just return the stolen money or what´s left of it?
People earn titles in universities but nothing else.
I make a pledge to spend every penny I earn as soon as I earn it since the mattress is not a good idea either.
If I cancel the life insurance I will loose half of it because it is bundled some Zürich fund.
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Создано: January 27, 2009 5:12 PM | Сообщение 168279 — ответ на №168275 |
John Bunch
 Expert      Родной язык: EnglishСообщений: 1807 На форумах с: February 1, 2008 Местонахождение: United States | RE: Understanding the Financial Crisis One guy who really gets it is John Bogle, CEO of Vanguard. Vanguard is unique in the financial services industry, I think, because they have no-load funds, meaning that you don't pay the finance people a lot of money. From everything I know, Bogle is a very honest man, and he decries the excesses on Wall Street. He has shown that it is possible to build a successful financial services company, help the investor, make some money, and sleep well at night. His new book is called "Enough", about the excesses of Wall Street.
Bogle's investment principles:
Bogle is famous for his insistence, in numerous media appearances and in writing, on the superiority of index funds over traditional actively-managed mutual funds. He believes that it is folly to attempt to pick actively managed mutual funds and expect their performance to beat a well run index fund over a long period of time.
Bogle argues for an approach to investing defined by simplicity and common sense. Below are his eight basic rules for investors:
Select low-cost funds
Consider carefully the added costs of advice
Do not overrate past fund performance
Use past performance to determine consistency and risk
Beware of stars (as in, star mutual fund managers)
Beware of asset size
Don’t own too many funds
Buy your fund portfolio – and hold it
[Отредактировано John Bunch, January 27, 2009 5:15 PM]
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Создано: January 28, 2009 11:28 AM | Сообщение 168376 — ответ на №168275 |
Bertha S. Deffenbaugh
 Expert      Родной язык: SpanishСообщений: 4572 На форумах с: May 9, 2003 Местонахождение: United States | RE: Understanding the Financial Crisis Originally written by Marie Glück on January 28, 2009 1:26 AM
The rich, educated CEO practically stole money from the poor and continue
exploiting even amidst this big scandal by ordering jets, expensive office decors, etc...
Obama is their last chance to turn aroun and redeem themselves, |
Citigroup – now depending on billions of taxpayers dollars--was about to spend 50 millions on a new corporate jet. (?!) Little did these idiots imagine the new president would prevent them from getting their new toy. Kudos to Obama.
Bertha
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Создано: January 28, 2009 1:22 PM | Сообщение 168394 — ответ на №168376 |
John Bunch
 Expert      Родной язык: EnglishСообщений: 1807 На форумах с: February 1, 2008 Местонахождение: United States | RE: Understanding the Financial Crisis It bothers me that we are now in a situation in which the president of the U.S. is telling private companies what to spend and what not to spend, like a dad telling his kid not to buy something. It is ridiculous. But on the other hand, Obama can say that the "bailout" now gives the government the right to do this, and up to a point, he is right. But there are those who claim that the real goal of the stimulous is to "redefine" the U.S. economy, making it far more statist and "command-control", which to me is really very, very questionable.
And let's face it, the job of the president is to protect us and give us overall direction, not to micromanage individual companies. IF there is a terrorist attack on the U.S. in the next 4 or 8 years, and Obama is president, the majority of people, I think will say "Obama was micomanaging Citibank while he should have been protecting us from these terrorists". and if that happens, it will destroy the Democatic party as a force, for the next 15 years.
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Создано: January 28, 2009 1:31 PM | Сообщение 168395 — ответ на №168394 |
John Bunch
 Expert      Родной язык: EnglishСообщений: 1807 На форумах с: February 1, 2008 Местонахождение: United States | RE: Understanding the Financial Crisis Obama's Stimulous Package is the largest pork barrel spending in U.S. history (maybe in world history), and includes $ 1 billion for Amtrak (which perpetually operates in the red and is - even by government standards, poorly managed), $ 21 million for "sodding the Mall" in D.C., and various other items on the Democratic (read: AFL/CIO) wish list. It should be called the "Pork Package". We are going to be pouring our tax dollars into these black hole projects. And by next year, these things will be part of the budget, so to cut any of this tax and spend, will be derided as "slashing social spending" and will be resisted by Congress. Meanwhile, we go more and more into debt with China and our interest rates rise. Only 12 % of Obama's plan actually goes into real infrastructure like bridges and roads. It is very, very sad:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123310466514522309.html
[Отредактировано John Bunch, January 28, 2009 1:32 PM]
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Создано: January 28, 2009 1:39 PM | Сообщение 168396 — ответ на №164457 |
Dodo Kaipdodo Мастер TC
 Expert    Родной язык: LithuanianСообщений: 1544 На форумах с: August 8, 2007 Местонахождение: Lithuania | RE: Understanding the Financial Crisis Say what you will, but I see only two main reasons for crises (inflation - certainly!). 1 is (needless?) people buying needless things (this seems to be good enough to become a Dodoism; I suppose I should make it one), and 2 is money not earned is still money. Sorry, guys and gals...
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Создано: January 28, 2009 1:43 PM | Сообщение 168397 — ответ на №168376 |
Marie Glück Мастер TC
 Elite Veteran  Родные языки: German, FrenchСообщений: 1014 На форумах с: March 8, 2005 Местонахождение: Austria | RE: Understanding the Financial Crisis Originally written by Bertha S. Deffenbaugh on January 28, 2009 11:28 AM
Originally written by Marie Glück on January 28, 2009 1:26 AM
The rich, educated CEO practically stole money from the poor and continue
exploiting even amidst this big scandal by ordering jets, expensive office decors, etc...
Obama is their last chance to turn aroun and redeem themselves, |
Citigroup – now depending on billions of taxpayers dollars--was about to spend 50 millions on a new corporate jet. (?!) Little did these idiots imagine the new president would prevent them from getting their new toy. Kudos to Obama.
Bertha
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I watch cnn and bbc and I dont believe they are kidding us- the ceo´s and the manager who spent almost 2mn in his office, and filed for a 10mn bonus obviously reads no newspaper. He must be too busy doing important things like spending money.
I have an economist acquaintance working for the UN who considers his job rather as a vocation. He sees himself as a humanitarian. He sees what he does as a means to promote a better life among people and explains in detail why. Hard to put his thought into words but one can perceive some kind of love of neighbhour in his approach to his work. Why can´t we get some more of such ones in wall street? There was once a very upright NYSE chairman in the 80´s- am wondering what happened to this gentleman.
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Создано: January 28, 2009 4:00 PM | Сообщение 168407 — ответ на №168397 |
David Kallans
 Expert       Родной язык: EnglishСообщений: 1752 На форумах с: April 13, 2007 Местонахождение: United States | RE: Understanding the Financial Crisis | Originally written by Marie Glück
I have an economist acquaintance working for the UN who considers his job rather as a vocation. He sees himself as a humanitarian. He sees what he does as a means to promote a better life among people and explains in detail why. Hard to put his thought into words but one can perceive some kind of love of neighbhour in his approach to his work. Why can´t we get some more of such ones in wall street?
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Corporate CEOs are responsible to their shareholders and have a legal duty to maximize profit. "Love of neighbor" is not a corporate mission, nor is it something the owners of the company generally care much about, certainly not to an extent that it would significantly decrease profit margins.
It is certainly laudable that your aquaintance views himself as a humanitarian, but there is a danger in being too smug here. Your acquaintance does the work he does because it maximizes his own personal interests, which in a major sense makes him no different than any other business person. His interests may be different, but maximizing shareholder profits is also a worthy goal. Many people view supporting their family as their primary duty, and maximizing profits can enable them to send children to college or care for an elderly relative. Let us not be too quick to condemn those who pursue profit, as you don't always know what their situation is.
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