...Except that it's not even the agencies' fault considering the current oversupply of global translators. It's the buyers' market.

Partially agree.

The translation market is saturated. You only have to look at the amount of people on this site.

But, part of the problem is that people assume that translation is cheap. I'll try and find the link, but the NHS in the UK spent £23 million on translation and interpretation last year, and the quotes for the general public was to use google translate. That is what agencies are also facing. Not everyone believe this, but many people do not see trnalsation as a profession. A lot of people d not understand why it will take months to translate a book...

It's very easy to say get the translators before you get the project. But this isn't always easy. I have a database of translators, and I don't know why some agencies don't. Therefore, unless a job comes across whereby I don't have someone with the specific skills required to complete it, I avoid posting jobs. It's a little different for interpreters, at least for me, as I live in the middle of nowhere, and Lincoln isn't easily accessible!

The bottom (sad) line is that people just want to make money. We're in the business of doing something for money. The agencies are in the business of doing something for money. This all ties into what Alison said. The way the world is now, what with everything being digitalized/globalized, the people you work for may very well be in totally different countries and you may never ever see them face to face. In my opinion, the lack of face to face dealings really makes it easier for people to get cutthroat and have no qualms about offering ridiculously low rates.

I agree with Jonathan though- maybe Jacek and Maxi have a different type of client base that is more well informed of the going rates of translation, but the niche I work in (Italian citizenship translations) pretty much guarantees that none of my clients are familiar with the industry beforehand and none of them know beforehand what a good rate is or isn't. My rates are posted on my website, but I doubt everyone reads them before contacting me. Jacek and Maxi- are your clients already people "in the industry" or are they people who need translations for personal reasons? I get a lot of clients doing genealogical research who want me to translate old diaries, letters, etc. It's really fascinating and I love my clients but none of them know anything about translation beforehand. I have never had such and end client who has haggled with me though. Only agencies seem to do that!

I, along with Jonathan, see nothing wrong with a client coming to me and saying, "look, I need this xxx translated and I have a budget of xxx. Could you take it on?" In our industry, that's the way things sometimes go. Are you two saying that a client has never asked you something like that and you are always free to state your rate before they state their budget? That's pretty great! It doesn't work that way for all of us, though. Unfortunately!

I don't think they (Maxi and Jacek) are saying that there's something wrong with that. What I read is that there's negotiation and a back and forth about what needs to be done, when it can be done and so on.

Based on negotiations, perhaps a compromise position about, say, the deadline, a price can be arrived at. Or, based on an extended deadline, I may suggest another price, which leaves the client with room to play the ball back into my court. When a client wants something 'pronto' the price is not as negotiable (if at all) as when the job can be done in between other jobs. A book translation with a very tight deadline that leaves no room to take on any other job, would cost more than the same book translation done at relative leisure over the next six months.

Nanna

Unlike Maxi's, my clients are all corporations, but the level of ignorance about what translation is about in the corporate world very often does not differ from individuals.

There's no denying that for sure! Many people are ignorant about our profession for sure. 

You really don't get any clients who come to you saying "this is our budget. Can you do the work within it?" I just feel like that's a pretty standard thing for a client to ask. 

Yes, it happens all the time around me, so I know it's normal, but I can afford to pick and choose...

oh dear... is this the ridiculous thread?

everyday, I wake up, go to my computer (to work) and find a slew of emails, many from new agencies that have picked me off the internet or my profile and that appear to have sprung up over night

here is one of today's "specials" .... not an agency but what is more and more common... a website claiming to be a directory or "network" appealing to freelancers and trying to eliminate the "middleman"

 www.tradagora.com

there are more and more of these types of sites, trying to intervene between translators and agencies, preying on freelancers who don't have time to market themselves and do their research (or know how to).
 
This one is typical ... no webmaster in sight, and no way to contact them.  They are all over the internet posting about themselves and trying to create hype.  Of course they aren't free ... I am sure they are pocketing money somehow.  This one is out of Belgium...and seems to have been in existence for 4 months now, or so my research says  http://mintportal.bvdep.com/MintPortal-CJFJAIIIEIAIFIEIEIFIJIAI.urk

I am not going to spend a lot of time on this one, but this is the bad side of the internet ... that seems to have no controls.  Even if you are a wary consumer ... it is pretty easy to get sucked in.  And once you have uploaded your data on a weak moment, you will never get it off...

So sure, those who are lucky get contacted by agencies and "get their price" and get paid, the rest of us, well, we get contacted too, and sometimes it is good, but it certainly is"translator beware"... welcome to the real world